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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 23, 2012 22:40:47 GMT
Introducing the ongoing saga of the latest Daf to escape the essex hoarders....... Reenie the daf 46 Super lux estate in "OMG I am SO" Orange.. sunday 22nd jan 2012she arrived sunday under the cover of darkness, her only crime so far was being the fact she had decided to pee all over the back of Minidans recovery truck, if you look on the picture you can see the odd green oily substance dripping at the back, it appeared to be coming directly from the rear trailing edge of the vario guard so I will fuind out when shes up and running where its coming from. got her into the corner at work and after putting her nice shiny car cover on to keep the rain out we went home here she is before saying goodnight Monday 23rd Jan 2012 A good day today, hooked up the works jump pack to her battery cables and after confirming the presense of ignition lights proceeded to whirr her over for a bit until the oil and gen lights extinguished, noticed no fuel being drawn into the filter so got a can of fresh jungle juice and a length of pipe and plumbed the pipe directly to the fuel pump but alas still no sucky, so job no1 it would seem is to rebuild fuel pump, I need her rolling starting and stopping before I can do anything else to her as I need to be able to move her around the workshops at work diving in whereever there is space at the end of the days work.. Really pleased with how she looks though, not took teh tape off her windows yet so havent inspected the window frame corrosion, but its only metal at the end of the day thats all for monday !!! apart from ... with a splash of fuel down the hole she fired straight into life perfectly on both cylinders till the fuel ran out, may have only been a few seconds but it was enough to show shes willing to play ball
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 24, 2012 18:27:41 GMT
Tuesday 24th
Got the spanners out and after struggling to remove the fuel pump realised there was onyl one way I was going to get on the nuts, off came the front guard, followed by mr Impellor then the big black plastic duct before finally the tin shields on the fuel pump side, access after that was simplicity itself.
I will post some pics after my tea of what was inside the pump but needless to say the diaphragm shows signs of failure as the fuel trap under the diaphragm had obviously had fuel evaporating off it and signs of wash , the diaphragm itself had also took on the appearance of a balloon ?? like it had delaminated and swelled, is this the effect of ethanol they warn us about?
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33grinder
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Post by 33grinder on Jan 24, 2012 19:34:27 GMT
Yes, they are a bit of an @rse to change Nick but glad you got there in the end. I doubt she's had recent ethanol heavy fuel in her to cause those symptoms to be honest. I'd expect her petrol to be older than that.
How are your workmates about the car? Quiet admiration or the ribbing you were expecting?
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 24, 2012 21:24:30 GMT
bit of ribbing.... mostly curiosity... one looked under the bonnet and shouted across the yard "they nicked the engine mate all they left is a starter motor in the bottom". . . says it all really lol dont it
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33grinder
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Post by 33grinder on Jan 24, 2012 21:51:03 GMT
That's a new one, normally I get the lawn mower jokes Nick. ;D But I just shrug off such comments as I know what a hoot these cars are to drive. And they don't.
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kenr
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Post by kenr on Jan 24, 2012 22:58:11 GMT
They're only jealous Nick. Well done for getting her to the new home. Maybe she should be called Jaffa.
Ken
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 24, 2012 23:36:52 GMT
she almost might not end up orange at all... we got some cool paints at work.. and I do so like a good zesty green you know.... Martyn is convinced I should ditch the entire inlet manifold and bolt a carb to each head (god knows where id get vaccumn from though) they dont (as you rightly said Pete) realise how much fun these little motors are even in standard form
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spunkymonkey
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Post by spunkymonkey on Jan 25, 2012 14:39:41 GMT
The diaphragm sounds like typical aging regardless of the fuel type, Nick. That was the state my Triumph's was in when I found myself sticking the layers back together with hylomar on a Gloucestershire hillside a while back
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 25, 2012 19:11:11 GMT
starts on the key now (running from a can) next issue is no drive of any description from the rear wheels.. i know when she was delivered I was clambering around in the front and put her in gear by mistake and then we tried in vain to roll her off the recovery truck (oops) and I wasnt the most gentle with the selector lever with dan rocking the car to get her back into neutral so maybe I bent a linkage somewhere (sorry if your reading this dave im not usually so heavy handed and do love her really)
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 26, 2012 17:27:08 GMT
well I will add this into the pot now, im a bit confused....
engine starts so quick its amazing, far outstarts BeeBee hands down... flick key, its running..
propellor shaft will not rotate AT ALL..
Jacked car up so one wheel off ground to confirm neutral and gears , they are selecting it would seem.... as in wheel locks in both gears but not in neutral. no amount of twisting will turn the propshaft (hand only because its aluminium) yet I can spin the engine freely by hand pressure. So... what locks a propshaft? car rolls in neutral just fine engine starts fine soon as revs increase and clutch comes in thats it.. engine is loaded and wont rev any more.. (havent pushed it as dont want to kill the clutch shoes)
any suggestions gratefully recieved
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spunkymonkey
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Post by spunkymonkey on Jan 26, 2012 17:40:29 GMT
Will the engine rev ok in neutral?
Can you turn the prop in neutral?
If no to the above then it's likely to be something jamming the clutch drum from the "outside" - either something in the bellhousing which is locking the drum or a seized rear clutch bearing (sits in the bellhousing extension). Unfortunately, iirc, you have an enclosed bellhousing on that one so you can't see inside it without puling the engine and dismantling but that's not too bad a job on these.
Might also be worth removing the starter motor and seeing if it frees up then (can't see how it would jam if it's starting the engine but it's easier than pulling the engine)
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 26, 2012 18:25:44 GMT
I can turn the slight bit and I mean like 1 or 2 degrees at the engine end... prop wont turn regardless of gear selector position,
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33grinder
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Post by 33grinder on Jan 26, 2012 18:26:52 GMT
Hmm,
The 46 has a de-dion rear axle so no differential effect. You'll need both wheels off the deck for your test.
Will she start in gear? If so but no drive then that's the propshaft metalstic coupling gone then. If she won't start but kangaroos on the starter then that's a seized clutch drum or clutch bearing.
Worth checking the linkage rod underneath is playing ball at either end too.
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pauldaf44
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Post by pauldaf44 on Jan 26, 2012 18:50:12 GMT
She should roll in gear just as well as she does in neutral. As the clutch can only! be engaged by turning the engine above a certain speed.
When pushing in Neutral the propshaft has no need to turn but it does when its in gear obviously.
Thinking of that should narrow the fault down. It cannot be a locked clutch drum else the engine would not start even in neutral as it would need to turn the prop to if the drum where locked. My bet would be the problem lies in the gearbox between the primarys at the input end as everything after should be ok (rolls in neutral) and as the engine runs the clutch should be ok.
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 26, 2012 19:21:33 GMT
ill reput it .. the propshaft CANNOT be turned, the engine runs until the revs reach a point where the clutch would engage then all you get is the smell of hot linings (so I turn it off).
Pete , as far as I am aware the 46 has a differential inside the rear box to make up for the fact it only has 1 belt driving but would have to check my book to confirm, therefor I can turn gearbox by turning one wheel only, wheel locks when its in gear (ie trying to turn prop) car does roll in neutral, we had to push it 500 yards to where it is parked, something has locked the clutch drum or primary gearbox. I will drop the sheilds tomorrow (was raining tonight) and see if I can effect a rotation of the propshaft in any way by moving the gear selector by hand
Paul, the flywheel and clutch shoes are free turning, I can rotate the engine just by pulling the fanbelt its that free... but the actual drum appears to be fixed in position
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pauldaf44
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Post by pauldaf44 on Jan 26, 2012 19:36:24 GMT
ill reput it .. the propshaft CANNOT be turned, the engine runs until the revs reach a point where the clutch would engage then all you get is the smell of hot linings (so I turn it off). Pete , as far as I am aware the 46 has a differential inside the rear box to make up for the fact it only has 1 belt driving but would have to check my book to confirm, therefor I can turn gearbox by turning one wheel only, wheel locks when its in gear (ie trying to turn prop) car does roll in neutral, we had to push it 500 yards to where it is parked, something has locked the clutch drum or primary gearbox. I will drop the sheilds tomorrow (was raining tonight) and see if I can effect a rotation of the propshaft in any way by moving the gear selector by hand Paul, the flywheel and clutch shoes are free turning, I can rotate the engine just by pulling the fanbelt its that free... but the actual drum appears to be fixed in position Right that really does narrow it down. Input side of the vario gearbox. Or stuck clutch drum as Joe said from the outside. Incidently 46 and 66 models do have a differential. On the earlier models the secondarys drive the wheels direct but on the de-dions they are both joined back together and the rear wheels are driven through a diff. I believe adjustment is done by moving the secondarys where as on the earliers it is the primarys that move when tensioning belts.
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 26, 2012 21:53:39 GMT
guess its guards off tomorrow to see if I can see anything untoward..
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spunkymonkey
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Post by spunkymonkey on Jan 26, 2012 23:06:40 GMT
Guards off is a good first step - especially seeing as you've got to locate that leak sometime But, having thought it through, I'd put (a small amount of) money on it being stuck at the clutch drum end for the simple reason that there's very little to go wrong in the primary that would still allow you to push it in neutral. When you push it like that the primary pulleys and the bevel gears have to turn so that means any locking at that end would have to be "forward" of that and there isn't really anything there except a pinion (unlikely top cause problems) and a couple of bearings (also unlikely to seize solid). So I'm going for either something outside the clutch drum wedging it to the bellhousing or (my personal favourite) the rear clutch shaft bearing seized through sitting around too long
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 27, 2012 18:45:14 GMT
well, a small update, dropped the covers today and the propshaft is free to rotate as far as it can on the splines of the primary , and infact with teh engine running you can feel the engine through the shaft so it would seem my drum is free. however NOTHING on the earth will move the unput side of the primary gearbox it is so locked solid .. yet in neutral she all rotates.. ? ? ? ? ? ? at a bit of a loss, the alternator on the modern died tonight on the way home so it seems teh car gods are pooping on me at the moment
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 28, 2012 7:40:25 GMT
was talking to your friend Matthew and he seems to think its not uncommon for the bearing at the front of this box to overheat if the oil was low and weld itself up.. hoping its not that of course but we shall see..
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 28, 2012 15:29:03 GMT
primary gearbox seized solid, got in in the boot of the car ready for strip and inspect. updates and photos to follow, also it had about enough oil in it to fill a teaspoon, which probably didnt help (least my clutch is ok)
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spunkymonkey
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Post by spunkymonkey on Jan 30, 2012 12:51:42 GMT
Looking at the pic in the book, there's really nothing there to seize on the input except 2 taper roller bearings. Shouldn't be too difficult (or expensive) a fix
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 30, 2012 17:51:51 GMT
andy the farm mechanic who seems to be happiest up to his ears in shims an god knows what is going to oversee me rebuilding it for a drink (and will source me the bearings-seals etc) through his suppliers.. I will of course keep a list of the part no.s and do a detailed thread on the rebuild of it should anyone else ever bother, and if its fubar then of course ill just pop down to essex dafs and get one..
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 31, 2012 18:03:44 GMT
right the primary is beginning to come apart and on first examination we found A: no oil or very little left in it.. B: the remants of a ball bearing carrier shattered and spread about inside the casings
we think the inner bearing has broken up and this is what has locked her solid, she must have been starting to "die" when Dave was still using her but I suppose the locking up would have been gradual and go unnoticed..
we will try and get the cross shaft out of her tomorrow (one with variator on) and then we can assess if the primary input shaft/gear is total toast or not
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stefan
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Post by stefan on Jan 31, 2012 22:00:48 GMT
I am sure you will have it done for the litchfield show mate
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Jan 31, 2012 22:51:08 GMT
would be nice mate.. would be nice for sure
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Post by flannelracing on Feb 2, 2012 22:29:59 GMT
DAM!!! I am really sorry Nick, It was being used up until it was taken off the road, I really cant explain it at all.... Sorry : ( As for the belt, that was supposed to be an all singing all dancing one from (names removed by the Ed, simply to minimise the possibility of hassle)
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Feb 3, 2012 20:04:29 GMT
John apologies, Dave... no apologies needed. I would think judging by the damage you wouldnt have even noticed it, maybe a slowing of power till when you parked her up and I as well as anyone else know how easy it is to miss something that happens gradually... how else has been for an MOT to be told a brake is not operating on one wheel, as to the belt, it has been sat in one position for 7 years so rolling it from its resting place onto the truck may have been enough to crack the rubber. As for the gearboxI believe it was only sitting in the one position that let it "set" in position, as even with 5ft stilsons there was no movement to be found and if she drove there.. well its a no brainer...... as to pictures, I am up to my forhead building this vehicle for the olympics so ahve not even had time to sniff the gearbox let alone strip it, but rest assured pictures will be forthcoming...
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Feb 25, 2012 21:32:22 GMT
new transmission aquires this weekend from my good friend Matt, so its all systems go for refit and finally she will be driving under her own steam.
Brakes are sorted Fuel and fuel lines are sorted engine has had tiny service so just welding and refit now
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Post by Nick the man with a daf.... on Feb 28, 2012 19:14:31 GMT
well my Mojo has took a major bashing tonight.. and to be honest had the car been ANY other brand of car I would have got one of the farm machines and squashed it flat.. seriously.... Struggled in the mud with an old trolley jack and the dafs original jack to get the vario into place under the car and then onto the jacks (only got sealey axle stands.. not very tall and im rather wide in the middle). Finally got the setup in a position where I could just get the propshaft onto the splines (spring at right end thank you Mr Matt for answering your phone) and after two hours I had it in place, everything bolted up, reconnected ready for a belt tighten and then hopefully a drive round the yard.
Problem no1.....
No amount of winding the adjuster will get me a gap at the back pulleys, belt measures 43mm wide (and was told it was new-remember the advert?)..
ok its on there enough to run the car and see if its going to change up down etc, start car (still on stands) and rev up the engine gently, sure enough I can see the wonders of the pulleys pull in and the car changes up beautifully and drops into overdrive as I back off the gas..
Problem no2.....
NS wheel not turning....
Problem no3.....
ok problem no 2 no problem ill use my lovely feeling brake pedal to stop other rear wheel before it breaks somerthing in the differential. Put foot on brake after engine has dropped to idle ( I let it spin down slowly to avoid stresses) hmm im standing 16 stone on this pedal and the wheel is still spinning gently..
needless to say the cover went back on the car, the tools got lobbed on the workbench, I went and fed teh sheep and now sit here fuming at the whole new list of things to sort that has just appeared...
humph...............
So I still have some odd transmission issue, be it belt or something else??? have a rebuild of the brakes to contend with now....
and I still havent so much as picked up a welding torch.....
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